A perfectly good meme but I would say it might still presume a little too much good faith.
They’re not undecided. They want to vote for Trump and are desperately hoping for a socially acceptable reason to do so.
It’s only them and God in the voting booth. What’s stopping them?
I think you answered yourself with the question. Someone better with words could make an OK joke out of it.
My Mexican immigrant coworker believes that if Kamala gets elected that immigrants will be deported but also immigrants are getting too much free money and food stamps and things like that. He really has bought into some kind of weird belief that Donald Trump is a better candidate. He can’t vote because he’s not a citizen. I think he’s just pissed off because he works two jobs and sees people who get free stuff and don’t come here legally as lazy.
Trying to combine immigrants in your first sentence is so disingenuous. Here’s what makes it clear:
Legal Immigrants are different than illegal immigrants. Of course your coworker is pissed off that he’s come here legally and is not getting rewarded for it. Whether the ones who come illegally are lazy or not doesn’t make a difference. They shouldn’t be given anything we currently give them. We have veterans dying in the streets getting nothing. Everyone should be mad about it.
What you’re saying is not precisely true. To register for food stamps, well, you need to be registered. Likewise for other forms of welfare.
Illegal immigrants are not coming to this country and living off of welfare. That is not happening.
But even if it was, are you seriously going to tell me that the solution to that is to kick those immigrants out? To round them up in camps? That’s not going to help homeless veterans.
People like you will either believe in stupid arguments or talk in bad faith, and then not actually support welfare or UBI at all.
Illegal immigrants aren’t getting money and services through our usual welfare program, but nice try implying that’s what we’re claiming.
And yes, kick out the ones here illegally. Not sure where you’re getting camps from, just move them out. Then we need to redirect sources to Americans that need it and we need to make sure those are being spent properly and not disappearing into bureaucratic pockets.
You do realize how just morally corrupt and insane that logic is right? We spend trillions as a country, you’re upset that immigrants might get something when our veterans program is still lacking. You are fighting over crumbs and upset at other crumb eaters instead of the elite being the ones only giving out crumbs. There are valid arguments and suggested tactics to help BOOST the economy with programs that can help veterans, immigrants, and includes social safety nets for all people. The distraction that “They’re Stealing Your Crumbs!tm” helps stop any progress and keeps the boogeyman so voters can be scared into submission.
We need immigrants to help a flailing economy thanks to the baby boomer population (immigrants help us economically!, it’s a statistical fact!). Immigrants also have lower crime rates than typical groups of people born here. Housing the homeless is cheaper than arresting them, ER visits (because no preemptive healthcare) are most expensive, ETC ETC. All the fear mongering is just lies, don’t believe the hatred and look into it yourself so you’re not spreading misinformation.
https://nij.ojp.gov/topics/articles/undocumented-immigrant-offending-rate-lower-us-born-citizen-rate
https://www.cfr.org/in-brief/how-does-immigration-affect-us-economy
https://www.globalgiving.org/learn/how-much-would-it-cost-to-end-homelessness-in-america/
I just love how the political discourse went from “should we have healthcare for all? (circa 2016)”, to “they took our jobs! (circa southpark 2004)”.
Very well put
It takes resources to “round them up and kick them out.” Resources that could instead be spent on the Americans that need it.
Out of the only two options on the ballot that have any chance of winning, which side shits on the veterans dying in the streets and which side tries to help them?
The electoral college picks the president. Not you. You’re a “migrant” labeled “citizen”. You can influence the election if you happen to walk by an actual elector and get a chance to talk to him… Tell him about your student loans, your fear of putin, the homeless, you two jobs just to pay the mortgage, etc. they’ll understand and vote the way you would vote if you were an actual elector… don’t you worry migrant!
Yey! Democracy!
Apparently putting a huge number of people in jail for minor possession of a drug that is only illegal because of racist 70s politics is spotless, and doing so to support capitalizing the prison system, is spotless. I call it dehumanizing and unconstitutional, but I just care about empirical data that apparently is completely unimportant in tribalist capitalist worshiping countries like the USA.
I don’t count “spotless prosecutorial record” as a win, but given the two viable choices I’ll take it over “shockingly successful fascist demagogue” every time, and twice on Sundays.
I holding my finger over the button as long as possible in the hope that the button that the “spotless prosecutorial record” will suddenly add the “stop abetting a genocide” portion we’ve been asking for since before they changed out the previous button, but I guess I’ll be going for the option that isn’t currently telling me how my existence is threatening to them and hope that they’ll follow through on valuing human life this time around.
Agree on your points, I honestly fucking hate cops and by extension prosecutors that enable and collude with them. However the only other option is worse than a pig.
Countless was a little under 2000 people (at least as far as Harris is concerned) That’s about half of what her predecessor in the same office did over roughly the same time period.
Now, that conviction is for “possession, sale, or cultivation”. Most paid a fine rather than serve jail time. We also don’t know the exact breakdown of possession vs sale vs cultivation.
We also know that Harris pushed for decriminalization and legalization in California, and has pushed some of the same as vice president. I think Joe is the roadblock there, even if he was convinced to pardon a bunch of people for simple possession.
Apparently you’re a nazi if you vote for either, so you should just not vote
- totally not an astroturfer
Four more days. And then another year? Maybe ten?
It’s exhausting.
Virginian here. It’s every year for us. State positions are in the odd years.
Spotless is a gross way to describe her career as a prosecutor.
Don’t know why you’re being downvoted, Harris isn’t perfect but with Trump on the other side not much is required of her to be the best option.
I’ll go as far to say she’s a huge piece of shit that smells less bad than trump but you’re still working with a turd
Care to elaborate? Strong words but it’s not really obvious to me what you could be referring to.
Harris is far worse than Trump. Her record includes extending peoples prison sentences for cheap labor to fight fires. Jailing parents of truant kids. Laughing about smoking weed herself after imprisoning people for it. Most of the people she kept behind bars are black.
You know what trump did? He gave permanent funding to HBC colleges. His First Step act reversed Biden’s Crime Bill that targeted black people. He also created a way for criminals to rejoin society after they finish their sentencing.
Amazingly you left out his rape convictions, his 34 felonies, his very public desire to have those that disagree with him assassinated, his admiration of Hitler, his racist rhetoric, his disrespect for our armed forces, his senility, and the thousand other batshit-insane things he’s done and promises yet to do.
If you want to discuss this- be fair and include ALL of who he is.
If you cannot do that, then you are admittedly here in bad faith.
If someone from .ml is saying Harris is worse than Trump, well then it must be true! Everyone knows to listen to the opinion of people who have been banned from communities for being fascist…
Thank you for giving us more reason to vote for Harris!
.ml coming with the chuckles!
Seriously, when is your Netflix special?
Just ignore him he’s too far gone.
*her *she’s
Trump separated children from parents and locked them in cages. The majority of these children still haven’t been returned to their parents.
He tried to illegally ban entire races from entering the country.
He elected judges to the supreme Court that over turned Roe v Wade, which is resulting in the death of pregnant women who can no longer receive life saving medical care.
He made Secret Service Agents rent rooms at hotels he owns, funneling money from the government into his own businesses.Trump refused the peaceful transfer of power
Lied that the election was stolen (and has never presented any evidence and his lawyers admitted in court that they have no evidence)
Encouraged an attempted insurrection
Idolizes dictators
Stated he wants to be a dictator Day 1
Wants people who oppose him to get shot…Oh, but some colleges got some funding so I guess that balances it out.
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Trump ripped families apart. The fact that you deny that any pretend to be a left speaks volumes. That was NOT a policy with ANY precedent
If you believe that, you’re either too young to remember what happened under Trump or you’re being disingenuous
Amazing, every single thing you said… Is wrong.
You are either willfully ignorant or maliciously spreading misinformation.
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I did vote for him, and you can call me fascist all you want, that word no longer has power behind it. I’m not fascist, trump isn’t fascist, most of his voters aren’t fascist.
Fascists exist, they’re just not in any way the majority.
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Ha. Haha. Hahaha hahaha. Oh man, thanks for the laugh.
I mean, these are proven things he did. You can laugh but it doesn’t change the fact that these things happened
350,831 Covid deaths in 2020 alone, 40% preventable with a competent response. Nominating 3 SCOTUS judges that ensured Roe being repealed and stripping away women’s bodily automomy in 21 states. But sure, Harris is an evil c***, right? I could go on with how horrible he was but of course, you won’t care. Cruelty is the point.
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Yaaawn…oh, did you try saying something?
To anyone that may be reading along and found this in the comments:
The comment I am responding to above illustrates how easy it is to cherry pick what makes one look bad, and the other look good, but it only works when one foregoes all evidence and empirically proven facts in favor of rhetoric and agenda.
Keep this in mind.
I didn’t cherry pick, I came up with major good things trump did and major bad things Kamala did. I can’t think of one good thing Kamala has done, her record is atrocious, and I responded to each claim the previous commenter made. Just took me a few days, since I have a life.
ROFL!
I didn’t cherry pick
and the immediately after….
I came up with major good things trump did and major bad things Kamala did.
I honestly have no words…
I mean, I followed up with I dont know anything good she’s done. She hasn’t done anything good. Id definitely list good things she did if there were any. There just aren’t any.
I honestly don’t think I can take part in this discussion any more. I don’t think it’s right to discuss the concept of cherry-picking with someone that adamantly denies they’re doing it-
then proceeds to perfectly illustrate the accusation.
I don’t think you understand what it is you’re saying and I think it’s unfair to continue having the advantage that I possess in this discussion.
Have a good day.
It all depends how you define a spot. Particularly the same spot test should be applied to both candidates.
Is it a spot if you grab someone who isn’t your favorite wife by the pussy?
How do you grab your own wife by the pussy? Like do you just go for it over whatever she’s wearing? Do you pull down her panties to actually grab her by the vagina?
What’s the proper vagina grab? Like do you apply pressure upwards and pull …nah that would slip easy! It’s a vagina, it’s got slime on it if you get near it. Nah. I think the best and most proper way is to insert one or more fingers into the vagina so you can pull.
I hope our president can tell us how to properly and legally grab women by the vagina. Maybe it will be a national sport one day… imagine a team of say 6 couples on each side, the get arranged like in football, except that they must be copulating. The goal is to walk around the field…full of couches and rugs and Lego bricks from the kids … And grab one of the opposite team’s women by the pussy. Each couple who’s woman gets grabbed by the pussy is automatically disqualified and has to exit the field. Extra points during sudden death if you can doggy or spit roast the guy.
Thank God Trump figured out how to grab them all by the pussy for us all. Right? 👍
Did the meme mention trump being spotless? Because I don’t think it did. He’s scum. Doesn’t make Harris spotless just less spotty
You didn’t sing this. I’m onto you “TrueTomBombadil.”
I’ll admit when I first started using the name I tried to write my comments sing songy but by the time I made it to Lemmy I was too lazy
I might not leave the country, but I’ll have to leave my state. I wonder if next Friday after work I’ll need to load up everything I can fit in my car and drive as far north as possible. It’s terrifying that my rights as a transgender human vanish will vanish overnight where I live. I’ve heard of bounties in Odessa.
Knowing that most of the people I live and work around are happily voting for a child rapist has broken my brain. The folks protesting at the Planned Parenthood (abortion is already illegal here) are going to vote for a man that’s probably paid for multiple abortions. It’s a sickness I can’t fathom.
Its sickening what is happening to this country, that you even feel the need to flee in such a way, but it is a realistic concern. There are people who very much want carte blanche to harm trans people, and if Trump is elected they may get that cover, its vile.
It’s optimistic of you to assume we’ll know the outcome by next Friday. Republicans are going to turn the whole election into a circus if they possibly can.
fully agree. hope you don’t have to move… but for some miraculous incomprehensible reason the race is a statistical tie
It’s so bizarre that it’s a warzone but just for the category you’re in. For now, anyway. Ugh.
❤️
what does the guy who’s openly threatening the future of American democracy think about my taxes
He thinks your taxes are too low and billionaires taxes are too high!
I was JUST thinking my taxes are too low!
Well fuck you bro! My code sucks harder!
Oh, really?
function add(x, y) { let b=x; while(b < x+y) { b++; } return b; }
Hmmmm
he promises a tax plan that will not materially improve things for you or i and a reduction in the things that taxes go towards that benefit us
and the people that stand to lose the most because of him call him their God emperor and vote for him
With a more representative electoral system, we could have more then two buttons. First-past-the-post voting is mathematically flawed and will always result in a two party system, which is why we must replace it as soon as we can.
Yall believe in democracy right?
I’m with you. What’s your plan?
There is a method that already exists. There are states that have signed an agreement where once enough states sign on to it, it automatically will go into effect. https://youtu.be/dFZyFmILb5w
That has nothing to do with this. That’s the interstate popular vote compact and all it does is make the winner of the popular vote the winner of the election. It does absolutely nothing to end two party dominance, and continues all of the exact same flaws of the existing system but without the electoral college, and even that only in the unlikely event that the compact survives the inevitable challenge in the supreme court. You still only get one vote for one candidate and it comes necessarily at the expense of any others.
You’re right I spose, but It’s the first step. Every time the ec elected a Republican in the last 25 years, a dem won the popular vote.
Once Dems actually start winning, Then you have the ability to make changes. There are already states that have implemented ranked choice voting.
I mean, winning isn’t the last step. The democrats are more likely to implement anything meaningful than the republicans, but we’re still going to have to drag them kicking and screaming into doing it. If everyone breathes a sigh of relief and relaxes on November 7th nothing will change. The real work STARTS then.
Exactly right that’s what I mean
I’ve started a gofundme.
Vote for the partiesand candidates that support ranked choice
First past the post voting is the cheapest and fastest use of taxpayer dollars. Must we overburden our poorest districts with purchasing requirements for fancy smancy vote counting machines? /s
In fact, this whole elections thing is just so expensive, a burdensome cost to the people. Wouldn’t you prefer to save money and enjoy the reduced risk with knowing a qualified expert is running things (\s)
(this legit is how the Heritage Foundation sounds)
Left out rapist under Trump’s “accomplishments”
I didn’t follow as closely. was he convicted of rape? I know he was accused. given his track record im 100% sure he’s guilty of everything. but I thought he managed to settle and weasel his way out so he’s not officially convicted as a rapist…
He raped his exwife, it was in their divorce filings. He did it as revenge for his hair plug surgery going badly.
According to judge Kaplan, he did, in fact, rape her: https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.590045/gov.uscourts.nysd.590045.212.0.pdf
He was found guilty of sexual assault.
that’s what I thought. he dodged the rape charge. if he was convicted of rape he would certainly have been sentenced, served time in prison, and be on the sex offender registry.
regardless, hopefully in a week we never have to think about him again
Whether or not he was convicted, it’s a fact that he is a rapist.
It won’t end after the polls close. The MAGA cult has been setting the stage to fight any results they don’t like which will certainly create a large amount of time until the results are fully certified.
It appears a good chunk really loves the racism thingy
It shouldn’t be, but I feel like this is such a delicate thing.
Like, Trump is obviously racist, but his base sees themselves in him and when he is labeled racist, it projects to them; they’re labeled racist too. They “know” they aren’t racist and it’s a strong accusatory word along the lines of being called a pedophile and that instantly brings up defenses and basically kills any chance of swaying their opinion. Besides, if we were wrong calling “them” (their projection from trump) racist, how could we possibly be right about calling Trump racist?
Should we give a shit what these people think? Really wish we didn’t have to, but the world isn’t fair and just enough at the moment to disregard the nuance here.
“Pedophile” is missing from the trump one…
Her record is not spotless tbh.
Anyway, easy solution to the problem: ban Trump and the GOP. Bam, fascism is no more.
Well, fascism will still exist if you ban Trump and GOP.
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The US has no mechanisms to ban political parties
and the constitution was basically i intended to prevent banning a party just because the current administration dislikes them.
You not only need to vote for the candidate of their choice, you also need to match whatever they pick. Yey! Democracy!
Enter to win!
Prices included: " new president!"
Rules:
-Pick whoever you want
-If the electoral college picks the person you picked, then congratulations! You picked the winner 🏆🏆🏆🏆!
-if the electoral college picks someone else, then congratulations! You got a different president than the one you picked because your vote is worthless!
Yey! Democracy!
But do go vote, this is just a sarcastic comment about the stupid way we pick…the electoral college picks presidents for us like kings. The rest of the ballot is full of things that you do actually vote for, like local representatives, education leaders, district judges etc. Only the presidential election is not actually your thing. The rest of it is probably more important anyway so who cares if the electoral college picks Mexico’s president to be our president. They could pick Kim Jung Un, but our president is usually a lame duck anyway the entire time due to the Republican party cock blocking their every move…like your student loans! Remember those? The fucking republican party block all attempts so far. But again, don’t worry about it, it’s not our thing. Let’s let the electoral college to worry about it.
The rest of the ballot is full of things […] like local representatives, education leaders, district judges etc.
Maybe OT, but I’ve been watching a lot of voting advice on twitter, reddit, etc this year, and whenever someone mentions how important it is to get educated about your local options on the ballot, they get a flood of comments accusing them of encouraging people to abstain from voting or to vote 3rd party. It appears to be one limb of an aggressive anti-vote apathy or disinfo campaign.
Not sure if it’s OT, but we definitely forget that the ballot affects you more personally within the other non presidential elections. Like the president, ultimately is just a guy. He’s not gonna come here locally and fix my potholes. It’s the local guy who does that shit. That’s the election we should be really keen on. And then sure, let’s build some more raptors and finish North Korea indirectly somehow before they do something stupid.
That’s not at all how the EC works.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Electoral_College#Selection_process
I get that we might have different opinions. But if you told me right now that you will vote as I want you to vote as my representative I would have a very realistically hard time believing you. You should probably never meet me in person and state that anywhere nearby and expect me not to laugh my ass off at you.
It’s not a matter of opinion. You’re misrepresenting how the EC works.
It isn’t a good system, but it’s also nothing like you characterized it.
Slates of electors are chosen to represent parties by the parties themselves, often in party conventions or primaries, and typically from a pool of people who are incredibly loyal to the party. That is even more true of smaller parties, as they tend to be more invested in their particular beliefs than the major parties.
Faithless electors are, so far, practically a non-factor in modern elections in the US. There are mechanisms in place in most cases that either invalidate their vote or outright remove and replace them. I can only cite one time in history that there was a significant impact, when the Virginia electors withheld their votes for Van Buren’s VP Richard M. Johnson. He had to be elected by the Senate due to the 23 withheld votes keeping him from a majority in the EC. That was in 1836.
Then why have electors at all? Why not just get together and state “we have 10 electoral votes for Kamela”. There’s no actual need to have a person who’s job is to literally walk to a place fill a bubble and put it in the envelope box.
I don’t care how the system works to vote for president. All I know is that it’s not my vote and I am a citizen. Can you say that’s a misrepresented statement? “It’s not my vote that elects a president” that is 100% true.
I’ll point back to you saying this:
the electoral college picks presidents for us like kings
Which is, for lack of a better way to put it, simply bullshit.
I’ll also point to you saying this:
I don’t care how the system works to vote for president.
Which sounds like willful ignorance about the election process. I don’t think that’s a position to be proud of.
You ask why we even have electors at all, as if that’s some sort of big “gotcha” monent. I already clearly stated that I don’t think it’s a particularly good system, especially coupled with FPTP and winner-talke-all. What it is, though, is the system we have, so understanding it is pretty vital.
Technically speaking, no, you do not directly vote for a presidential candidate in the general election. In practice, your vote almost certainly will be represented by the electors you vote for if your chosen candidate wins your state or if you live in Nebraska or Maine. Certainly, the electors could be removed entirely from the process while electoral votes remain. That would remove one unnecessary part of the equation, but would it solve anything?
Here’s the real fun: winner-take-all. It’s more damaging than indirect election. Let’s pretend you live in one of three districts that vote for (electors pledged to) Alice, one in a landslide and two hotly contested. But the other two districts in your state elect (electors pledged to) Bob. The statewide popular vote is close but slightly in favor of Bob. Congrats, all seven of your states EC votes go to Bob even though your district overwhelmingly supported Alice, and she won 60% of the districts. Who needs faithless electors when your vote can truly not count for anything? This is how WTA is worse for democracy than electors.
Okay now let’s imagine we did have awesome candidates to choose from not just Kamela, the orange back of peanut Grease and the several others in the list that were never mentioned except for a couple of times when they explained why only Kamela and Trump were in the debates. If let’s say we had two really strong republicans that could get democratic votes against two really strong democrats who could easily get republican votes…how could my vote as a Democrat count at all if I voted for one of the republicans but then I happened to be in a democratic state like Texas (lol. Let’s pretend Texas had mostly democratic electors). Like you mentioned, the electoral vote would be winner takes whatever…all or some. My individual vote is either diluted via population and number of representatives per stated, or eaten up by Jerrymandering or whatever. I say fuck the electoral college, count all the damn votes and make the popular vote win.
Having some sort of mechanism that requires attention to be paid to areas other than high-population centers is probably a good thing. In the system we have now, it swings too far in the other direction by giving some disproportionate power to small pop red states and even more to battleground states. A shift away from WTA, along with replacing FPTP with STAR voting, would be more impactful than abolishing the EC. Even better would be adjusting the size of the House to better normalize the population of districts.
There have been hundreds of attempts to abolish or change the EC. It’s really looking like our best options for real reform are STAR voting and proportional representation.
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Undecided voter = person who cannot discern truth
I don’t understand how there are undecided voters this election… I understand trump voters. Ride or die republicans, bigots, wealthy people that want more money for themselves. They are fucked up, but they make sense.
But how are you undecided? What are you weighing up. If you’re not in the aforementioned groups, what single positive thing does trump offer?
I’ve seen some people try the free speech angle. But that isn’t true either. Neither he nor Elon are actually about free speech.
Right? How can that be said with a straight face with all these “woke” book bans. And then Trump saying he wants to arrest the media for saying bad things about him.
No, they’re inherently more anti free speech than the people they’re puroportedly against, anyone using that justification is either ignorant or only cares about not getting in trouble for being a bigot
Undecided voters aren’t undecided because they’re oblivious to what’s going on. They’re undecided because they live in a swing state, so they have more power than the average voter, and most importantly they want something. They see the candidates campaigning specifically for them. They’re hoping to be offered a promise they actually care about.
And yet the things wanted are being pretty directly ignored to hopefully find other no voters in swing states and rag them out to vote.
It’s been a pretty obvious back and forth of requests and then ignoring them and trying to offer something else. I don’t know how people are confused about what is happening.
My guess is the Palestinian issue which puts people on the fence. Both parties would still support the Israeli government.
Both parties would still support the Israeli government.
Exactly, and Trump is so much worse in everything else, not to mention that he’d also be worse in the very Palestinian issue you’re concerned about! Even with this issue in the equation I still don’t understand it
Well, I’m not American so I cannot feel the existential dilemma between picking a genocider or ride or die genocider. But if I am electing, I certainly don’t want to feel being forced to pick either two. I imagine many Americans probably feel uncomfortable with that as well.
Additionally, another factor with Trump still polling remarkably well is because a lot of people perceive the economy under Trump to be better. Take it as you will, but people under economic pressure feel forced to pick the extreme. People typically value economic security over liberty, unfortunately.
Yeah, the ingrained illusion that Republicans are better for the economy is a very unfortunate one
The only reason I can actually understand an undecided voter is if it’s actually a strategic decision to entice the parties to give them more. An undecided voter is worth so much that Elon is literally giving away millions of dollars to sway them. Yeah it’s chump change to him but it’s still unprecedented. It would be kind of like a nullifying jurur, in that they’re saying something completely different than what they’re thinking. That totally gives undecided voters way more credit than they’re actually due, because in reality they’re just ignorant of the situation.
in the states it’s so easy. you just choose between the status quo or the obvious deranged evil. here we vote on the lower positions and nobody ever knows who any of them are and we don’t have proportional so everyone just votes by party and the names are largely meaningless
